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Ore
5 replies to this topic - Started By Dasbuba, Sep 30 2014 11:52 PM

#1 Dasbuba

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Posted 30 September 2014 - 11:52 PM

Since there are no Monster at this point its hard to figure out how the game look like at release. How will we build weapons? I would preffer some kind of ironore mines and forges. Just think this could be very nice. But i think u have allready a plan for that ray :)
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Complications arose, stopped and were overcome.


#2 Rayvolution

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Posted 01 October 2014 - 12:59 AM

Yep, already have a plan for it. Although I'm not sure exactly if it'll work yet, so that's why I've been keeping it to myself. :)


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#3 KyoShinda

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Posted 22 November 2014 - 09:03 PM

I guess one way you could do it is have stone work sites also sort out ores (so they would hold rock and ores. The ore wouldn't 'exist' until it adds to the ore count in the building) and then have a forge send out people to the stone places to collect them and at the forge have a top down view of blacksmiths working on their anvils and the armor being worked on would go through stages like carrots growing in the field and when they are done with an armor they place it in the storage in the forge (they would only exist as a number and wouldn't exist as a resource in deconstruction) and the amount of armor would change the max amount of troops you can have (they would look like a sword or armor on the anvil, but it would represent a set). The troops would automatically fill the highest tiers of equipment.

 

One problem is that their might have to be tracking numbers on each resource since you could make a mason pull out a stone, cancel his job, cancel the building, then put the stone back in the stone site to get endless ore from one rock. You could say using a stone in construction would free up a number keeping the numbers low, but since you can deconstruct buildings it would still have to keep track of that number.

 

Maybe instead of tracking numbers, a hidden number counts up for every rock that comes into existence (mined) and for every, let's say 6-9, rocks placed in a mason place, an iron ore goes up and they would both keep track of a maximum idk that got complicating really fast, hopefully there would be a simple way to do it.

 

It's just that an ore dropping along with a rock when mined would be messy and an ore number going up for mined rock but no actual physical presence would be kind of lame.


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#4 Hexicube

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Posted 24 November 2014 - 04:16 PM

I always thought it would be nice to have a way to paint rocks with ores that then get mined and can be smelted into their respective ingots, and I'm sure I mentioned that to Ray at some stage. I can't for the life of me remember the reply, though.

 

If it was done like that, it would eliminate a number of issues:

- Rock with ore would be clearly different, making it easier to do the management of mining

- Rock with ore would exclusively give it's ore, making it impossible to 'dupe' ore like you stated

- Adding new items is easier than making stone 'store' ore within itself

 

The main issue is making stone tile correctly with ore deposits, so that it looks 'normal'. Obviously, the game isn't exactly normal, but you can still manage to have something out of place in it, so having the iron ore look like a part of the stone is needed. Either that, or it would have to be separate sections of stone entirely, which might actually help distinguish it as a separate resource.


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#5 KyoShinda

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Posted 24 November 2014 - 05:31 PM

I always thought it would be nice to have a way to paint rocks with ores that then get mined and can be smelted into their respective ingots, and I'm sure I mentioned that to Ray at some stage. I can't for the life of me remember the reply, though.

 

If it was done like that, it would eliminate a number of issues:

- Rock with ore would be clearly different, making it easier to do the management of mining

- Rock with ore would exclusively give it's ore, making it impossible to 'dupe' ore like you stated

- Adding new items is easier than making stone 'store' ore within itself

 

The main issue is making stone tile correctly with ore deposits, so that it looks 'normal'. Obviously, the game isn't exactly normal, but you can still manage to have something out of place in it, so having the iron ore look like a part of the stone is needed. Either that, or it would have to be separate sections of stone entirely, which might actually help distinguish it as a separate resource.

I do think it would look better and be pretty cool the ways you put it but knowing where all the ore is kind of gets rid of some game variation. I mean sure, you can see where all the other resources are, but ores don't have to be the same.

 

I guess spawn point creates some variation, but it might get to the point where it's like 'If I spawn here, I'll build X and X building and run straight to this ore vein'. Then again, having random chance of getting certain ores wouldn't really add much to the game because it's like 'oh I got lucky and got 4 iron', sort of like it happened instead of earning it, there's still a certain joy to having good luck with something though.

 

All the best games are half randomness and half tactics, with no tactics it's not really a game and with no randomness it gets repetitive so if the game as a whole already has enough variation then unhidden ore would work pretty well.
 


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#6 Hexicube

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Posted 24 November 2014 - 05:41 PM

I do think it would look better and be pretty cool the ways you put it but knowing where all the ore is kind of gets rid of some game variation. I mean sure, you can see where all the other resources are, but ores don't have to be the same.

 

I guess spawn point creates some variation, but it might get to the point where it's like 'If I spawn here, I'll build X and X building and run straight to this ore vein'. Then again, having random chance of getting certain ores wouldn't really add much to the game because it's like 'oh I got lucky and got 4 iron', sort of like it happened instead of earning it, there's still a certain joy to having good luck with something though.

 

All the best games are half randomness and half tactics, with no tactics it's not really a game and with no randomness it gets repetitive so if the game as a whole already has enough variation then unhidden ore would work pretty well.
 

 

Bear in mind all current resources are specifically placed around the map, there's no reason ores should be any different. It can still randomise the amount per block though, like the current resources seem to.

 

Also remember that mob spawns are likely also randomised, so no matter what strategy you do you will almost always have to improvise down the line, and having solid knowledge of the map helps with that.

 

Ideally, the game should lean towards a level of random that poker has, not one that a dice has. That way, it's still ultimately possible to make something out of horrific cases (2/7 non-matching suits is the worst start poker hand, but you can bluff your way through it or get lucky with the next cards), but in most cases it would still result in losing pretty fast. There's also the ability to get completely destroyed by random chance despite an amazing start (pocket pair of 10s and up are the best start hand, but I've still lost with that kind of hand). With a dice roll, it's "Oh, I rolled a 1, gg., not fun.


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